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By: Tuffgirl on 5/19/08
This is a great way for the city to collect money and cause lots of wrecks as people slide to a screetching halt. Declared unconstitutional in Virigina and under litigation in Kentucky. I guess we will be next.
This is a great way for the city to collect money and cause lots of wrecks as people slide to a screetching halt. Declared unconstitutional in Virigina and under litigation in Kentucky. I guess we will be next.
By: Trvlace on 5/19/08
They already slide to a screeching halt, those I don't worry about, it is the ones who charge on when the light in the other direction is green that worry me most. Maybe it will reduce the "better than thou" people racing to beat the light and going in other people's turn. I drove in Phoenix, AZ a lot and never saw any wrecks and felt safer with this system in place. As is now the traffic lights are stoptions, which means if you don't see a cop, stopping is and option!
They already slide to a screeching halt, those I don't worry about, it is the ones who charge on when the light in the other direction is green that worry me most. Maybe it will reduce the "better than thou" people racing to beat the light and going in other people's turn. I drove in Phoenix, AZ a lot and never saw any wrecks and felt safer with this system in place. As is now the traffic lights are stoptions, which means if you don't see a cop, stopping is and option!
By: ups.jer on 5/20/08
I've been watching the town where I grew up go through this transition. People are quite upset by the fact that they receive the citation, regardless of who is driving. Say you lend your car to your 16 year old, other relative, or friend...guess who pays the ticket?
I've been watching the town where I grew up go through this transition. People are quite upset by the fact that they receive the citation, regardless of who is driving. Say you lend your car to your 16 year old, other relative, or friend...guess who pays the ticket?
By: attagirl on 5/20/08
The "ticket" can't go on your driving record because it is unconstitutional. So they get around it by calling it a "civil fine."
If I get one, they'll have to spend more than it's worth suing me for it. I won't pay it.
The "ticket" can't go on your driving record because it is unconstitutional. So they get around it by calling it a "civil fine."
If I get one, they'll have to spend more than it's worth suing me for it. I won't pay it.
By: justdance on 5/20/08
Thank you TRVLACE, and I agree with you on this one, I appreciatre your giving us an example of how these cameras CAN work instead of coming up with reasons why they can't. They're here, they're staying, fuss all you want, you won't win this one Murfreesboro, grow up!
Thank you TRVLACE, and I agree with you on this one, I appreciatre your giving us an example of how these cameras CAN work instead of coming up with reasons why they can't. They're here, they're staying, fuss all you want, you won't win this one Murfreesboro, grow up!
By: cjohnson on 5/20/08
We are actually lucky because in other states the fine is double what it is here. I think the only people that fight about them being up are the people that did this. So many people die because of red lights being ran, it's best to catch them now instead of when it is too late. And to go with DMW37128's comment they are ugly, I have seen these cameras in other cities I was surprised that Murfreesboro decided to get the biggest & ugliest ones out there.
We are actually lucky because in other states the fine is double what it is here. I think the only people that fight about them being up are the people that did this. So many people die because of red lights being ran, it's best to catch them now instead of when it is too late. And to go with DMW37128's comment they are ugly, I have seen these cameras in other cities I was surprised that Murfreesboro decided to get the biggest & ugliest ones out there.
By: Ponycar on 5/20/08
These cameras are unconstitutional in all 50 states. Sadly, only a few states realize that. They are a disregard to our 5th amendment right to due process. What ever happended to innocent until proven guilty ? With these cameras, your guilty until proven innocent.You are 100% correct tuffgirl. These cameras are all about collecting revenue for the city. The city of Chattanooga was recently ordered to reimburse fines from these cameras because it was proven that they shortened the yellow light times on them to catch more people and collect more money. The yellow light at Northfield and Memorial sure seems shorter now.Sorry justdance, you say we won't win this one. I beg to differ. The people of Chattanooga won and exposed this scam. My hope is that the state supreme court will catch on and rule these cameras unconstitutional in Tennessee.Sorry but I'm just not willing to sit back and let them chip away at my constitutional rights.
These cameras are unconstitutional in all 50 states. Sadly, only a few states realize that. They are a disregard to our 5th amendment right to due process. What ever happended to innocent until proven guilty ? With these cameras, your guilty until proven innocent.You are 100% correct tuffgirl. These cameras are all about collecting revenue for the city. The city of Chattanooga was recently ordered to reimburse fines from these cameras because it was proven that they shortened the yellow light times on them to catch more people and collect more money. The yellow light at Northfield and Memorial sure seems shorter now.Sorry justdance, you say we won't win this one. I beg to differ. The people of Chattanooga won and exposed this scam. My hope is that the state supreme court will catch on and rule these cameras unconstitutional in Tennessee.Sorry but I'm just not willing to sit back and let them chip away at my constitutional rights.
By: lupusman on 5/20/08
I am confused as to why they are unconstitutional. I don't understand why the argument of no right of due process. If someone gets a ticket from these cameras can't they go to court and fight it? I guess I may not know all the facts about them but I just returned from a trip to Virginia and I assure you the cameras are alive and well in many parts of the Hampton Roads areas. I do agree with some people here about the yellow lights being too short. The yellow at the intersection of Thompson lane and NW Broad is very short for drivers on Thompson Lane who are crossing Broad. A vehicle going 40MPH is moving at 60 feet per second. The yellow at this intersection seems to be on for no more than a second. Therefore if you are less than 60 feet away from the intersection when the light turns yellow you will most likely be in the intersection when it turns red. And Broad Street is 8 lanes wide at that intersection - 2 lanes going straight and 2 left turn lanes in both directions! But why is everyone always trying to ban, stop, and fight things like this? If the cameras are functioning properly, and you DON'T run a red light, you have nothing to worry about. If these cameras save the life of one person they are worth it.
I am confused as to why they are unconstitutional. I don't understand why the argument of no right of due process. If someone gets a ticket from these cameras can't they go to court and fight it? I guess I may not know all the facts about them but I just returned from a trip to Virginia and I assure you the cameras are alive and well in many parts of the Hampton Roads areas. I do agree with some people here about the yellow lights being too short. The yellow at the intersection of Thompson lane and NW Broad is very short for drivers on Thompson Lane who are crossing Broad. A vehicle going 40MPH is moving at 60 feet per second. The yellow at this intersection seems to be on for no more than a second. Therefore if you are less than 60 feet away from the intersection when the light turns yellow you will most likely be in the intersection when it turns red. And Broad Street is 8 lanes wide at that intersection - 2 lanes going straight and 2 left turn lanes in both directions! But why is everyone always trying to ban, stop, and fight things like this? If the cameras are functioning properly, and you DON'T run a red light, you have nothing to worry about. If these cameras save the life of one person they are worth it.
By: lightchick on 5/20/08
I for one am looking forward to this cameras being up and running. I see red light runners in this town everyday. When they install the one at Church and Broad, that's where they will catch the most.
I for one am looking forward to this cameras being up and running. I see red light runners in this town everyday. When they install the one at Church and Broad, that's where they will catch the most.
By: Admiral on 5/20/08
Church and Broad is the place that needs them the most. Also the left turn signal from Church onto Broad needs to be twice as long in time as it is now. Get behind a student driver turning left and you are lucky to make the arrow at all. The cameras should not ticket right hand on red turns.
Church and Broad is the place that needs them the most. Also the left turn signal from Church onto Broad needs to be twice as long in time as it is now. Get behind a student driver turning left and you are lucky to make the arrow at all. The cameras should not ticket right hand on red turns.
By: HuskyLover on 5/20/08
I'd like to see the cameras on every light in the county. If you're not breaking the law, you won't be photographed.
Just this afternoon, I drove down a 3 mile stretch of road that has 7 lights. At every light, someone ran the red. EVERY LIGHT. It wasn't a matter of driving under a yellow - every time the light was RED and the car/truck just went on through like the rules didn't apply to them. Sickening the lack of respect and character so many people seem to have now days.
I'd like to see the cameras on every light in the county. If you're not breaking the law, you won't be photographed.
Just this afternoon, I drove down a 3 mile stretch of road that has 7 lights. At every light, someone ran the red. EVERY LIGHT. It wasn't a matter of driving under a yellow - every time the light was RED and the car/truck just went on through like the rules didn't apply to them. Sickening the lack of respect and character so many people seem to have now days.
By: Ponycar on 5/20/08
Unconstitutional because it does not prove beyond a reasonable doubt that I was driving when the infraction took place. It only has a picture of my vehicle license plate. If my son, friend or neighbor is borrowing my truck, runs a light, and gets a ticket, I am the one they're coming after for the money because the truck is registered to me. Unlike if I'm stopped by the police. If I was to get stopped, there is no doubt that I was the one driving. Huskylover says that if you're not breaking the law, you won't be photographed. Well,in Chattanooga,and other cities, it was the city officials who were the ones breaking the law.
Unconstitutional because it does not prove beyond a reasonable doubt that I was driving when the infraction took place. It only has a picture of my vehicle license plate. If my son, friend or neighbor is borrowing my truck, runs a light, and gets a ticket, I am the one they're coming after for the money because the truck is registered to me. Unlike if I'm stopped by the police. If I was to get stopped, there is no doubt that I was the one driving. Huskylover says that if you're not breaking the law, you won't be photographed. Well,in Chattanooga,and other cities, it was the city officials who were the ones breaking the law.
By: attagirl on 5/20/08
It's unconstitutional because we are all entitled to cross examine any witness against us, and it is impossible to cross examine a photograph. That is a direct violation of due process.
There is an easy solution. Have all lights at the intersection red for 3 full seconds after each green light. As it is now, one turns red and the other turns green at the same time. That's just stupid.
It's unconstitutional because we are all entitled to cross examine any witness against us, and it is impossible to cross examine a photograph. That is a direct violation of due process.
There is an easy solution. Have all lights at the intersection red for 3 full seconds after each green light. As it is now, one turns red and the other turns green at the same time. That's just stupid.
By: Ponycar on 5/20/08
And the photograph don't even have a picture of you driving. It's a picture of your license plate.To the people who think this scam is right I ask, if you were to get a ticket in the mail, are you going to pay it just because they said they have a picture of you car running a light? Even if it were someone else driving your options are A) pay the ticket, or B) Be inconvenienced by having to go to court,spending a good part of your day there ( probably while you are also having to take time off work), to rat on the person who was driving. If we as citizens allow this BS to go unchallenged, what will they do next?
And the photograph don't even have a picture of you driving. It's a picture of your license plate.To the people who think this scam is right I ask, if you were to get a ticket in the mail, are you going to pay it just because they said they have a picture of you car running a light? Even if it were someone else driving your options are A) pay the ticket, or B) Be inconvenienced by having to go to court,spending a good part of your day there ( probably while you are also having to take time off work), to rat on the person who was driving. If we as citizens allow this BS to go unchallenged, what will they do next?
By: junkman on 5/20/08
It's as much a revenue source as it is a deterrent. The authorities that authorized the cameras didn't have enough nerve to raise taxes so they contract with the camera company but give 1/2 of the revenue to the people running the camera. There have been instances in other municipalities where the yellow light has been shortened in order to CAUSE & therefore catch more drivers. Anyone remember when we could go to the store & not be on camera the whole time?
It's as much a revenue source as it is a deterrent. The authorities that authorized the cameras didn't have enough nerve to raise taxes so they contract with the camera company but give 1/2 of the revenue to the people running the camera. There have been instances in other municipalities where the yellow light has been shortened in order to CAUSE & therefore catch more drivers. Anyone remember when we could go to the store & not be on camera the whole time?
By: barrettbear on 5/20/08
Well let us take a moment and breathe folks. Ugly is seeing someone dismemered and doa because someone ran a red light. Not the poles or cameras. Next, it is just citations not tickets. Everyone has been for warned about all this. The lights are shorter to get people in the habit of driving safely and sensible. The officer monitoring these cameras is being trained to as when and when not to issue a ticket. I have personally never really loaned my vehicle to any one to drive because I had an option on vehicle isurance to have others on the policy. Guarantee, it really does concern me what other states have in place or do, but if anyone decides they want to run a red light some unknown reason and I am hit and receive injuries it will be more than a civil lawsuit. This biting back and forth on line is another reason I ask myself and wonder why our children and communities are distraught and can not function and get along as one.
Well let us take a moment and breathe folks. Ugly is seeing someone dismemered and doa because someone ran a red light. Not the poles or cameras. Next, it is just citations not tickets. Everyone has been for warned about all this. The lights are shorter to get people in the habit of driving safely and sensible. The officer monitoring these cameras is being trained to as when and when not to issue a ticket. I have personally never really loaned my vehicle to any one to drive because I had an option on vehicle isurance to have others on the policy. Guarantee, it really does concern me what other states have in place or do, but if anyone decides they want to run a red light some unknown reason and I am hit and receive injuries it will be more than a civil lawsuit. This biting back and forth on line is another reason I ask myself and wonder why our children and communities are distraught and can not function and get along as one.
By: attagirl on 5/20/08
"Why can't we all just get along?"
Are you kidding? We're supposed to just sit back and watch our government chip away at our civil rights, from the white house on down to our very own city council.
There are plenty of other ways to deter red light runners. I happen to like the old fashioned way - a cop must witness it and then pulls you over and issues a ticket. Simple. Easy to contest if you don't agree you violated.
Change the lights so they are safer. Make them all red for a few seconds before anyone turns green. That way no one gets rear-ended from fear of the cameras, and everybody is safer.
Make the penalty for red-light running more severe if it's such a problem. Sort of like they do speeding in a school zone.
There's plenty of other ways without having big brother taking our freaking picture and mailing us a "citation" that can't be contested.
"Why can't we all just get along?"
Are you kidding? We're supposed to just sit back and watch our government chip away at our civil rights, from the white house on down to our very own city council.
There are plenty of other ways to deter red light runners. I happen to like the old fashioned way - a cop must witness it and then pulls you over and issues a ticket. Simple. Easy to contest if you don't agree you violated.
Change the lights so they are safer. Make them all red for a few seconds before anyone turns green. That way no one gets rear-ended from fear of the cameras, and everybody is safer.
Make the penalty for red-light running more severe if it's such a problem. Sort of like they do speeding in a school zone.
There's plenty of other ways without having big brother taking our freaking picture and mailing us a "citation" that can't be contested.
By: KeptMan on 5/21/08
for someone to be DOA or dismembered from someone else running a red light it would have to be more than just running the red light. that person would have to have seriously not been paying attention, run into the back end of the car in front at a high rate of speed, pushing them into oncoming traffic from a dead stop and them being hit by someone else going at normal to just above normal speed through the intersection. and i must agree with attagirl. our rights are being pecked away at by not only local government but by the white house administration we have now.
for someone to be DOA or dismembered from someone else running a red light it would have to be more than just running the red light. that person would have to have seriously not been paying attention, run into the back end of the car in front at a high rate of speed, pushing them into oncoming traffic from a dead stop and them being hit by someone else going at normal to just above normal speed through the intersection. and i must agree with attagirl. our rights are being pecked away at by not only local government but by the white house administration we have now.
By: bbeaird on 5/21/08
For the people suggesting we just lengthen the time between opposite lights turning red and green -- do you really not think people wouldn't just figure out that they've got two extra seconds to run the light instead of just the one?
I was in Dallas a couple years ago after they had recently implemented a major camera ticketing system of their own. There was a lot of controversy there as well and some local news footage of accidents caused by people slamming on their brakes at intersections. Back in March 2008, however, it was reported that red-light running has dropped so much that many of the cameras have stopped generating enough revenue to support themselves (that's a good thing!).
The brake-slamming thing really shouldn't happen. Cars are either driving too fast or the yellow light is too short. It's not the camera's fault.
One thing I hope our government is wary of is not to become reliant on this revenue. If it is successful, the revenue should decrease over time.
Red-light running is a big problem in Murfreesboro. I don't know that these cameras are the best way to help it, but I guess we'll see.
For the people suggesting we just lengthen the time between opposite lights turning red and green -- do you really not think people wouldn't just figure out that they've got two extra seconds to run the light instead of just the one?
I was in Dallas a couple years ago after they had recently implemented a major camera ticketing system of their own. There was a lot of controversy there as well and some local news footage of accidents caused by people slamming on their brakes at intersections. Back in March 2008, however, it was reported that red-light running has dropped so much that many of the cameras have stopped generating enough revenue to support themselves (that's a good thing!).
The brake-slamming thing really shouldn't happen. Cars are either driving too fast or the yellow light is too short. It's not the camera's fault.
One thing I hope our government is wary of is not to become reliant on this revenue. If it is successful, the revenue should decrease over time.
Red-light running is a big problem in Murfreesboro. I don't know that these cameras are the best way to help it, but I guess we'll see.
By: Boo on 5/21/08
TRVLACE- Thank you and AMEN!!
TRVLACE- Thank you and AMEN!!
By: DMW37128 on 5/21/08
Now, if we could get drivers to stop at the "stop line" instead of going past it by a car length or more. Hard to make a left turn when a car is almost sitting in the intersection ( this is frequently done at Old Fort and St. Andrews, Old Fort and Cason, NW Broad and Memorial, Church at Broad. )
Now, if we could get drivers to stop at the "stop line" instead of going past it by a car length or more. Hard to make a left turn when a car is almost sitting in the intersection ( this is frequently done at Old Fort and St. Andrews, Old Fort and Cason, NW Broad and Memorial, Church at Broad. )
By: Boo on 5/21/08
We have a responsibility to know what kind of driver we are loaning our vehicle to! I never allow anyone else to drive my truck, but I realize not everyone has that choice. However, should I ever have to, they would know that if they break the law, they will pay ALL court costs and fines and never drive my vehicle again. Let take responsibility for the choices we make and bring the cameras on!!
We have a responsibility to know what kind of driver we are loaning our vehicle to! I never allow anyone else to drive my truck, but I realize not everyone has that choice. However, should I ever have to, they would know that if they break the law, they will pay ALL court costs and fines and never drive my vehicle again. Let take responsibility for the choices we make and bring the cameras on!!
By: Ponycar on 5/21/08
Again, these cameras have been ruled unconstitutional in other states. One state ruled that the red light cameras offered fewer due process protections than available to drivers who were fined for the same offense in the conventional way after having been stopped by a police officer.The court also ruled that the cameras violate the "reputable presumption" doctrine which eliminates the presumption of innocence.They further stated that owner liability for red light violations where the owner neither required nor knowingly permitted the violation was unfair. I feel that these cameras should be banned in all 50 states because they are unconstitutional and violate our 5th amendment right to due process of law. Whether or not you loan your vehicle to someone else is your buisiness. My point is that they did not catch you commiting the violation by these cameras. Are you just going a pay a "citation" that you recieved in the mail even if your not sure that were in violation of the law at the place and time in question ? I feel that cities that allow these cameras are violating the constitutional rights of its citizens. Traffipax inc makes money off of these cameras, and so does the city. That is what it's really all about.
Again, these cameras have been ruled unconstitutional in other states. One state ruled that the red light cameras offered fewer due process protections than available to drivers who were fined for the same offense in the conventional way after having been stopped by a police officer.The court also ruled that the cameras violate the "reputable presumption" doctrine which eliminates the presumption of innocence.They further stated that owner liability for red light violations where the owner neither required nor knowingly permitted the violation was unfair. I feel that these cameras should be banned in all 50 states because they are unconstitutional and violate our 5th amendment right to due process of law. Whether or not you loan your vehicle to someone else is your buisiness. My point is that they did not catch you commiting the violation by these cameras. Are you just going a pay a "citation" that you recieved in the mail even if your not sure that were in violation of the law at the place and time in question ? I feel that cities that allow these cameras are violating the constitutional rights of its citizens. Traffipax inc makes money off of these cameras, and so does the city. That is what it's really all about.
By: justdance on 5/21/08
Ponycar...blah, blah, blah
Boo.....DOGGONE RIGHT!
don't loan your car to someone else to drive, but if you do, make sure they know it will be THEIR responsibility to handle the citation. Some people just like to whine.
Ponycar...blah, blah, blah
Boo.....DOGGONE RIGHT!
don't loan your car to someone else to drive, but if you do, make sure they know it will be THEIR responsibility to handle the citation. Some people just like to whine.
By: KeptMan on 5/21/08
constitution? put the crack pipe down. this state, city, county, they don't know what that is. they do, but hope you the public has no clue as to what it is. they will ram things down your throat constitutional or not and wait for someone to object to it and fight it out. the costs involved make chances slim to none it will happen, so they have in effect stomped all over the constitution with no remorse.
constitution? put the crack pipe down. this state, city, county, they don't know what that is. they do, but hope you the public has no clue as to what it is. they will ram things down your throat constitutional or not and wait for someone to object to it and fight it out. the costs involved make chances slim to none it will happen, so they have in effect stomped all over the constitution with no remorse.
By: attagirl on 5/21/08
bb, yes I do think people would figure it out. But it would certainly make the cameras more fair if there was a 2-3 second interval of red before anyone turned green.
Like I said in the beginning, they will have to sue me to for any "citation" I receive, and even then I doubt I'll pay it.
bb, yes I do think people would figure it out. But it would certainly make the cameras more fair if there was a 2-3 second interval of red before anyone turned green.
Like I said in the beginning, they will have to sue me to for any "citation" I receive, and even then I doubt I'll pay it.
By: Ponycar on 5/21/08
Justdance, blah, blah blah ? Well I'm going to keep complaining about it every chance I get because as a taxpayer and registered voter, I have a right to complain. Keep in mind that this is an opinion board.I have just as much right to voice my opinion as you do. If you don't like my opinion, then don't read it.I'm sorry the fact that this scam is unconstitutional bothers you so much.
Kept man, You are right. Someone will challenge a citation, win their case just like in Chattanooga and Nashville, and it will cost the city and taxpayers more money in the long run.
Justdance, blah, blah blah ? Well I'm going to keep complaining about it every chance I get because as a taxpayer and registered voter, I have a right to complain. Keep in mind that this is an opinion board.I have just as much right to voice my opinion as you do. If you don't like my opinion, then don't read it.I'm sorry the fact that this scam is unconstitutional bothers you so much.
Kept man, You are right. Someone will challenge a citation, win their case just like in Chattanooga and Nashville, and it will cost the city and taxpayers more money in the long run.
By: Farmall on 5/21/08
We wouldn't need these cameras if the police actually cared enough to write a few tickets for running red lights. Many times I have seen people run lights while turning and a police car is sitting right there. Not once have I ever seen an officier go after one to even give them so much as a warning.
We wouldn't need these cameras if the police actually cared enough to write a few tickets for running red lights. Many times I have seen people run lights while turning and a police car is sitting right there. Not once have I ever seen an officier go after one to even give them so much as a warning.
By: borobehr on 5/21/08
Good Grief. Why can't drivers follow the rules and stop! Cut the crap about unfair just because you may get caught.
Take your turn at the light. It is a law, I believe.
Good Grief. Why can't drivers follow the rules and stop! Cut the crap about unfair just because you may get caught.
Take your turn at the light. It is a law, I believe.
By: barrettbear on 5/21/08
Attagirl I really think you are pushing in the seat of negativity. Keptman< I have read your responses to other articles and what a sight for sore eyes. When taxes go up you have to pay, when milk goes up you have to pay, gas prices you have to pay. I really doubt that thes cameras are really no different thaen Paul Vaughn studios or a digital camera. Accuracy is 99.9%. With all these cars trucks and semis on the road factor in a cell phone, alcohol, and some drugs (maybe lack of sleep or a heart attack) and your speed and you have ingredients for a fatality. Then these cameras can shed alittle light on what happened. Some of you say things are not ran right or your rights are violated, I perceive them as though they are not RIGHT to suit you. Boo, I hope whoever is driving your vehicle is insured because if it is your vehicle it can come back to the owner. Ponycar complain and dance but I have yet to see cameras from not going up. However on the flipside of this I would have to agree I do not think it will last long.
Attagirl I really think you are pushing in the seat of negativity. Keptman< I have read your responses to other articles and what a sight for sore eyes. When taxes go up you have to pay, when milk goes up you have to pay, gas prices you have to pay. I really doubt that thes cameras are really no different thaen Paul Vaughn studios or a digital camera. Accuracy is 99.9%. With all these cars trucks and semis on the road factor in a cell phone, alcohol, and some drugs (maybe lack of sleep or a heart attack) and your speed and you have ingredients for a fatality. Then these cameras can shed alittle light on what happened. Some of you say things are not ran right or your rights are violated, I perceive them as though they are not RIGHT to suit you. Boo, I hope whoever is driving your vehicle is insured because if it is your vehicle it can come back to the owner. Ponycar complain and dance but I have yet to see cameras from not going up. However on the flipside of this I would have to agree I do not think it will last long.
By: Boo on 5/21/08
Yes! If a citation is issued on my vehicle I will pay it and learn from it, and you can bet the person I was fool enough to loan my vehicle to will pay me back. Either out of their wallet or out of their hide.
Yes! If a citation is issued on my vehicle I will pay it and learn from it, and you can bet the person I was fool enough to loan my vehicle to will pay me back. Either out of their wallet or out of their hide.
By: diddlede on 5/21/08
I really don't know if I am for against the camera's yet. All I know is there are many cities that are having to return fines as was mentioned by someone posting here. Also, in Atlanta the camera company set the yellow light to go off much sooner than they do now so they could get the extra revenue. Since the camera company here will be getting more of the revenue from the camera than the City of Murfreesboro this could happen here. I have put Tommy Bragg on notice of this with an article from the Atlanta newspaper. Hope this does not happen here. If you have the patience, time the yellow light and if you see something suspicous let the mayor know. Too in the cities that have the cameras the insurance rates are going up because of accidents. We don't want our individual insurance rates going up here. Guess we will just have to play the waiting game and see how it all works out.
I really don't know if I am for against the camera's yet. All I know is there are many cities that are having to return fines as was mentioned by someone posting here. Also, in Atlanta the camera company set the yellow light to go off much sooner than they do now so they could get the extra revenue. Since the camera company here will be getting more of the revenue from the camera than the City of Murfreesboro this could happen here. I have put Tommy Bragg on notice of this with an article from the Atlanta newspaper. Hope this does not happen here. If you have the patience, time the yellow light and if you see something suspicous let the mayor know. Too in the cities that have the cameras the insurance rates are going up because of accidents. We don't want our individual insurance rates going up here. Guess we will just have to play the waiting game and see how it all works out.
By: barrettbear on 5/21/08
Diddlede, check the the light at Memorial and Thompson lane, it could possibly be the first complaint. The second at Broad and Thompson lane/ Broad st. I do agree I smell something fishy about the whole thing.
Diddlede, check the the light at Memorial and Thompson lane, it could possibly be the first complaint. The second at Broad and Thompson lane/ Broad st. I do agree I smell something fishy about the whole thing.
By: attagirl on 5/21/08
barretbear says, "Then these cameras can shed alittle light on what happened."
Do you not see the problem here? How do you cross examine a photograph? "Shed a little light" comes nowhere near "beyond a reasonable doubt," which we are ENTITLED to by our Constitution.
You people are not looking for a solution. You are looking for revenge and retribution against red-light runners.
barretbear says, "Then these cameras can shed alittle light on what happened."
Do you not see the problem here? How do you cross examine a photograph? "Shed a little light" comes nowhere near "beyond a reasonable doubt," which we are ENTITLED to by our Constitution.
You people are not looking for a solution. You are looking for revenge and retribution against red-light runners.
By: Ponycar on 5/22/08
I seen them installing a camera on Northfield and Broad today. When was the last time you've seen a wreck on that intersection ? At the inside right turn lane, there is a no turn on red sign. That is why they're putting a camera there. They know they'll collect lots of revenue there.
I seen them installing a camera on Northfield and Broad today. When was the last time you've seen a wreck on that intersection ? At the inside right turn lane, there is a no turn on red sign. That is why they're putting a camera there. They know they'll collect lots of revenue there.
By: junkman on 5/22/08
In the first place, yellow is a caution light. It means the light will soon change. It isn't a stop light. Shortening the yellow is done ONLY to enhance revenue. It has a negative impact on safety as it encourages people to slam on the brakes. I just love how our concerned government protects us since we have no way of taking care of ourselves. Just imagine how safe we'll all be when we extend the cameras from the streets into our houses.
In the first place, yellow is a caution light. It means the light will soon change. It isn't a stop light. Shortening the yellow is done ONLY to enhance revenue. It has a negative impact on safety as it encourages people to slam on the brakes. I just love how our concerned government protects us since we have no way of taking care of ourselves. Just imagine how safe we'll all be when we extend the cameras from the streets into our houses.
By: schia_21 on 5/22/08
Why is everyone whining about this so much? If you don't run the light, you won't get a ticket. Suck it up and follow the laws! Ironic that some want to argue that the cameras are unconstitutional, yet overlook the blatant fact that it's also a law not to run the red lights.
Also, I have to disagree about the 3 second delay - this is the worst thing we can do for red light runners. I have been to other big cities that have NO delay and no one runs the lights for fear of being slammed into by oncoming traffic. If we have a delay, it's just one more excuse for selfish Murfreesboro drivers to run the light because "Hey, I have an extra 3 seconds!" I hope these cameras do cut down on the driving violations I see every day. It's becoming embarrassing to have people come visit (not just from out of state, but from other Nashville-area cities!) and have to hear the constant comments of how horrible and insanely selfish Murfreesboro drivers are.
Why is everyone whining about this so much? If you don't run the light, you won't get a ticket. Suck it up and follow the laws! Ironic that some want to argue that the cameras are unconstitutional, yet overlook the blatant fact that it's also a law not to run the red lights.
Also, I have to disagree about the 3 second delay - this is the worst thing we can do for red light runners. I have been to other big cities that have NO delay and no one runs the lights for fear of being slammed into by oncoming traffic. If we have a delay, it's just one more excuse for selfish Murfreesboro drivers to run the light because "Hey, I have an extra 3 seconds!" I hope these cameras do cut down on the driving violations I see every day. It's becoming embarrassing to have people come visit (not just from out of state, but from other Nashville-area cities!) and have to hear the constant comments of how horrible and insanely selfish Murfreesboro drivers are.
By: attagirl on 5/22/08
"Suck it up and follow the laws!"
Couldn't have said it better myself. The Constitution is the supreme law of the land, and it certainly trumps a city law.
"Suck it up and follow the laws!"
Couldn't have said it better myself. The Constitution is the supreme law of the land, and it certainly trumps a city law.
By: diddlede on 5/22/08
I wonder if we will be given the right to check the photograph out before paying a ticket and before going to court to make sure it is our tag number. I will not pay a ticket until I see the photograph and I think we all need to have that right. I will not pay a ticket that comes in the mail until I am sure it is my car tag.
I wonder if we will be given the right to check the photograph out before paying a ticket and before going to court to make sure it is our tag number. I will not pay a ticket until I see the photograph and I think we all need to have that right. I will not pay a ticket that comes in the mail until I am sure it is my car tag.
By: Ponycar on 5/22/08
When someone breaks a law, the 5th amendment of the constitution guarantees that they are to be presumed innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. The red light cameras goes by the assumption of guilt, not the presumption of innocence. I do consider myself to be a safe driver schia 21,I havent had a ticket in over 25 years. I'm all for enforcement of laws that make our roads safer. As long as that enforcement does not violate our rights as the traffic light cameras do. I also don't like the fact that the cameras will be used a source of revenue under the guise of making our roads safer. I honestly feel that the city officials don't give a crap about the safety of citizens on the roads.
When someone breaks a law, the 5th amendment of the constitution guarantees that they are to be presumed innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. The red light cameras goes by the assumption of guilt, not the presumption of innocence. I do consider myself to be a safe driver schia 21,I havent had a ticket in over 25 years. I'm all for enforcement of laws that make our roads safer. As long as that enforcement does not violate our rights as the traffic light cameras do. I also don't like the fact that the cameras will be used a source of revenue under the guise of making our roads safer. I honestly feel that the city officials don't give a crap about the safety of citizens on the roads.
By: life_is_short on 5/22/08
You people are confusing a citation with a criminal charge. You know, if you leave your car in a no parking zone, or the meter runs out, you get a citation. Doesn't matter if you drove it or if you loaned it to your next door neighbors third cousin. The owner of the vehicle is responsible for the vehicle at all times. Remember drives ed? So you get the parking ticket and either pay it or make the driver pay it. How is this any different? Other than if I have a ticket on my car because the meter ran out, how do I really know it ran out? If I run a red light, odds are I'll say oh &*%^ when it happens and when the picture that is worth a thousand words shows up in my mailbox, how will I really deny it?
Bottom line is, have a police officer knock on your door and tell your your husband, wife, mother, father - fill in the blank - was involved in an accident because someone just ran a red light - then come back and argue your case. Not one person on this forum can deny the issue exist. I've lived in cities much larger than this, with many many more cars on the road. But never have I experienced the fear I fear when I go though an intersection in Murfreesboro in any other city. Just yesterday I hesitated before going through the light change at Thompson and Broad. Good thing I did because a car came flying through the intersection. Oddly enough I was lightly rear ended because the car behind me was ready to go through the light instead of paying attention. It's not about big brother. It's about us not using common sense to begin with. And if you're doing the right thing, it will never matter to you.
You people are confusing a citation with a criminal charge. You know, if you leave your car in a no parking zone, or the meter runs out, you get a citation. Doesn't matter if you drove it or if you loaned it to your next door neighbors third cousin. The owner of the vehicle is responsible for the vehicle at all times. Remember drives ed? So you get the parking ticket and either pay it or make the driver pay it. How is this any different? Other than if I have a ticket on my car because the meter ran out, how do I really know it ran out? If I run a red light, odds are I'll say oh &*%^ when it happens and when the picture that is worth a thousand words shows up in my mailbox, how will I really deny it?
Bottom line is, have a police officer knock on your door and tell your your husband, wife, mother, father - fill in the blank - was involved in an accident because someone just ran a red light - then come back and argue your case. Not one person on this forum can deny the issue exist. I've lived in cities much larger than this, with many many more cars on the road. But never have I experienced the fear I fear when I go though an intersection in Murfreesboro in any other city. Just yesterday I hesitated before going through the light change at Thompson and Broad. Good thing I did because a car came flying through the intersection. Oddly enough I was lightly rear ended because the car behind me was ready to go through the light instead of paying attention. It's not about big brother. It's about us not using common sense to begin with. And if you're doing the right thing, it will never matter to you.
By: Ponycar on 5/22/08
Why don't you do some research on these cameras, then come back and argue you case? You will see how cities manipulate the system, and laws to collect revenue. When you get a parking citation, they don't send your ticket in the mail a few days after the fact.
Why don't you do some research on these cameras, then come back and argue you case? You will see how cities manipulate the system, and laws to collect revenue. When you get a parking citation, they don't send your ticket in the mail a few days after the fact.
By: attagirl on 5/23/08
In addition, parking is somewhat like a contract. You give me a parking place and I give you X number of dollars. If I don't, you've got a legitimate gripe.
Apples and oranges, life is short.
In addition, parking is somewhat like a contract. You give me a parking place and I give you X number of dollars. If I don't, you've got a legitimate gripe.
Apples and oranges, life is short.
By: barrettbear on 5/23/08
You all have nice Memorial Day weekend
You all have nice Memorial Day weekend
By: life_is_short on 5/24/08
ummm, attagirl - a drivers licenses IS a contract. the state is allowing you to operate a vehicle legally and in exchange, you are agreeing to obey the laws of ANY municipality you operate a vehicle in. ALL of the laws, not just the ones we like. you fail to do so and the city, county or state has a legitimate gripe. which tends to results in consequences. including citations.
apples to apples, attagirl
ummm, attagirl - a drivers licenses IS a contract. the state is allowing you to operate a vehicle legally and in exchange, you are agreeing to obey the laws of ANY municipality you operate a vehicle in. ALL of the laws, not just the ones we like. you fail to do so and the city, county or state has a legitimate gripe. which tends to results in consequences. including citations.
apples to apples, attagirl
By: attagirl on 5/24/08
No, dear, it's not a contract. Our government is fond of calling it a "privilege." A contact requires consideration. There is consideration in your parking example, but not the licensing example.
No, dear, it's not a contract. Our government is fond of calling it a "privilege." A contact requires consideration. There is consideration in your parking example, but not the licensing example.
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