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Yahoo!Member Opinions:
By: ellie on 8/29/10
Mike,
A candid and honest assessment - what is needed here is education. You have a lot of honesty admiting you've never had dialogue with a Mulsim. It is truly unfortunate that the leaders of the anti Islam movment in Murfreesboro like Zelenik, would never be as candid.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/08/26/AR2010082605510.html?hpid=opinionsbox1
Kudos.
Mike,
A candid and honest assessment - what is needed here is education. You have a lot of honesty admiting you've never had dialogue with a Mulsim. It is truly unfortunate that the leaders of the anti Islam movment in Murfreesboro like Zelenik, would never be as candid.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/08/26/AR2010082605510.html?hpid=opinionsbox1
Kudos.
By: bullrun on 8/30/10
I agree with ellie. Mixing pop music with culture and humanity, Vinson gave readers a breath of fresh air from the 'heat' that surrounds the Islam ordeal. Excellent creative journalism. And I like Cat Stevens!
I agree with ellie. Mixing pop music with culture and humanity, Vinson gave readers a breath of fresh air from the 'heat' that surrounds the Islam ordeal. Excellent creative journalism. And I like Cat Stevens!
By: elguapo on 8/30/10
I feel the columnist is giving Pat Robertson a bit too much credit. I don't feel that a "sincere and intelligent man" would
interject his opinion in such an outlandish way as to a local issue that he is so distanced from.
I feel the columnist is giving Pat Robertson a bit too much credit. I don't feel that a "sincere and intelligent man" would
interject his opinion in such an outlandish way as to a local issue that he is so distanced from.
By: hspeaks on 8/30/10
As bullrun noted, Vinson used a different approach here in addressing the mosque issue and he pulled it off nicely. While I agree with elguardo that Pat Robertson's remarks were somewhat "outlandish", a debate featuring Robertson and Cat Stevens is a heady concept because both are well educated, high profile and a large number would tune in to hear what they had to say.
As bullrun noted, Vinson used a different approach here in addressing the mosque issue and he pulled it off nicely. While I agree with elguardo that Pat Robertson's remarks were somewhat "outlandish", a debate featuring Robertson and Cat Stevens is a heady concept because both are well educated, high profile and a large number would tune in to hear what they had to say.
By: lexanne on 9/1/10
What good could come of a debate with a quack like Pat Robertson. Might I remind you this is the same person that wants to do away with the Dept of Education and the Dept of Energy? This is also the same person that said Katrina was a punishment from God for abortion. He also claimed that Haiti's founders had sworn a "pact to the Devil" in order to liberate themselves from the French slave owners and that caused the earthquakes...P-leasssssee....No way... Negatory good buddy! Is this just a feeble attempt to get readers attention. If so I guess you accomplished that much but how about suggesting something that would inspire "social harmony".
What good could come of a debate with a quack like Pat Robertson. Might I remind you this is the same person that wants to do away with the Dept of Education and the Dept of Energy? This is also the same person that said Katrina was a punishment from God for abortion. He also claimed that Haiti's founders had sworn a "pact to the Devil" in order to liberate themselves from the French slave owners and that caused the earthquakes...P-leasssssee....No way... Negatory good buddy! Is this just a feeble attempt to get readers attention. If so I guess you accomplished that much but how about suggesting something that would inspire "social harmony".
By: AReader on 9/1/10
lexanne, remember, Vinson said, "Here an idea," when mentioning a debate between Pat Robertson and Cat Stevens. He was making a point that apparently flew by you. But I totally agree that Pat Robertson would be a good choice because he is well educated in Christianity and he is high profile, highly visible and his presence would command a huge number of listeners. Since this is a national controversy, we need someone who will draw national attention. I do agree that Robertson tends to be ultra conservative and might over-state himself on occasions, but if you're gonna call him a "quack" you might as well go on and call every minister on television a "quack". Plus, like Vinson said Lou Dobbs would keep things under control.
lexanne, remember, Vinson said, "Here an idea," when mentioning a debate between Pat Robertson and Cat Stevens. He was making a point that apparently flew by you. But I totally agree that Pat Robertson would be a good choice because he is well educated in Christianity and he is high profile, highly visible and his presence would command a huge number of listeners. Since this is a national controversy, we need someone who will draw national attention. I do agree that Robertson tends to be ultra conservative and might over-state himself on occasions, but if you're gonna call him a "quack" you might as well go on and call every minister on television a "quack". Plus, like Vinson said Lou Dobbs would keep things under control.
By: lexanne on 9/2/10
AReader....No it didn't fly by me at all. I just think a suggestion such as that is idle and would result in nothing more than MORE ill feelings towards the Muslim faith. I'm not even Muslim but I respect all faiths. Personally I wouldn't call every TV Minister a quack. Joel Osteen seems to have his head on a little tighter and would draw just as much attention. Maybe even the right attention for a change....instead of just attention for "the sake of seeing what crazy things will come out of Robertson's mouth this time". Which lets face it...that's what that would become. He may be well educated in Christianity but he doesn't represent any Christian I would want to know with his words of hate. Not very Christian in my book. I can see the headlines already!!!....How about something not so far to the right....more in the middle. If any at all...that's a discussion that should be held. That's a discussion that could produce results....understanding, tolerance, acceptance of other faiths, diversity and unity. Not ill informed hatred but educated "social harmony." And I'm not even sure that someone of "national attention" stature is what is needed here. So much can be done on a local level that would eventually get national attention (just as the first story did) and probably be just as successful.
AReader....No it didn't fly by me at all. I just think a suggestion such as that is idle and would result in nothing more than MORE ill feelings towards the Muslim faith. I'm not even Muslim but I respect all faiths. Personally I wouldn't call every TV Minister a quack. Joel Osteen seems to have his head on a little tighter and would draw just as much attention. Maybe even the right attention for a change....instead of just attention for "the sake of seeing what crazy things will come out of Robertson's mouth this time". Which lets face it...that's what that would become. He may be well educated in Christianity but he doesn't represent any Christian I would want to know with his words of hate. Not very Christian in my book. I can see the headlines already!!!....How about something not so far to the right....more in the middle. If any at all...that's a discussion that should be held. That's a discussion that could produce results....understanding, tolerance, acceptance of other faiths, diversity and unity. Not ill informed hatred but educated "social harmony." And I'm not even sure that someone of "national attention" stature is what is needed here. So much can be done on a local level that would eventually get national attention (just as the first story did) and probably be just as successful.
By: Colonel on 9/2/10
Pat Robertson is a clever and successful businessman. He has not enjoyed personal success as a politician but he has used his money and his media power to establish a powerful influence politically.
In my opinion, he is not an effective minister. He simply uses the cloak of ministry to make money and to publish his narrow-minded form of theology. He is not well-educated in Christianity. His view of Christianity is limited to his own particular persuasions and he is not charitable enough to recognize and respect the beliefs of others. He plays on the fears, suspicions and paranoia of the masses of fundamentalist/evangelical Christians. He views patriotism and religion in the same light and promotes a form of civil religion above a pluralistic and universal acknowledgement that there may be others whose beliefs are just as valid as his. Pat would not agree to a debate with anyone. He prefers to stand behind his "bully pulpit" and make his ridiculous "prophecies" and mean-hearted statements in his own safe environment where he is free from reasonable and educated contradiction.
Pat Robertson is a clever and successful businessman. He has not enjoyed personal success as a politician but he has used his money and his media power to establish a powerful influence politically.
In my opinion, he is not an effective minister. He simply uses the cloak of ministry to make money and to publish his narrow-minded form of theology. He is not well-educated in Christianity. His view of Christianity is limited to his own particular persuasions and he is not charitable enough to recognize and respect the beliefs of others. He plays on the fears, suspicions and paranoia of the masses of fundamentalist/evangelical Christians. He views patriotism and religion in the same light and promotes a form of civil religion above a pluralistic and universal acknowledgement that there may be others whose beliefs are just as valid as his. Pat would not agree to a debate with anyone. He prefers to stand behind his "bully pulpit" and make his ridiculous "prophecies" and mean-hearted statements in his own safe environment where he is free from reasonable and educated contradiction.
By: Gman1 on 9/2/10
What has happened here is that Vinson, with good intentions and an unorthodox but adroit skill set, sneaked one in and it yielded great results. I'm sure that Vinson thoroughly realized that there'll never be a televised debate featuring Pat Robetson against Cat Stevens. However, at the time of Vinson's column, Pat Robertson was in the mix of the Murfreesboro mosque contoversy due to comments he made about possible bribes. And Cat Stevens is a household name. It was great timing. You might say Vinson tossed in a stun grenade at just the right moment and flushed out those in hiding - he provoked thoughts and responses, and both God and Allah know that this is an issue that damn well needs to be thought about and talked about before it goes over the edge and carries everyone with it. Instead of passively hovering over the middle, like most do, Vinson combined wit and courage and it proved to be successfull. Good job at tactical stealth, Vinson. I would have you on my team any day.
And lexanne, Joel Osteen? A squint eyed, money grubbing pretty boy in my book. Even though I have some reservations about Pat Robertson, I would place as much faith in him as I would Osteen or any of those other televangelists($$$$$$)
What has happened here is that Vinson, with good intentions and an unorthodox but adroit skill set, sneaked one in and it yielded great results. I'm sure that Vinson thoroughly realized that there'll never be a televised debate featuring Pat Robetson against Cat Stevens. However, at the time of Vinson's column, Pat Robertson was in the mix of the Murfreesboro mosque contoversy due to comments he made about possible bribes. And Cat Stevens is a household name. It was great timing. You might say Vinson tossed in a stun grenade at just the right moment and flushed out those in hiding - he provoked thoughts and responses, and both God and Allah know that this is an issue that damn well needs to be thought about and talked about before it goes over the edge and carries everyone with it. Instead of passively hovering over the middle, like most do, Vinson combined wit and courage and it proved to be successfull. Good job at tactical stealth, Vinson. I would have you on my team any day.
And lexanne, Joel Osteen? A squint eyed, money grubbing pretty boy in my book. Even though I have some reservations about Pat Robertson, I would place as much faith in him as I would Osteen or any of those other televangelists($$$$$$)
By: lexanne on 9/3/10
Colonel...exactly! Gman1...the Olsteen comment was simply my attempt at TRYING to find someone a bit more neutral on a national level but if you read my entire posting you should know that I don't really encourage that kind of debate anyway. And yes most of them are in it for the money but that's the fault of the followers that through it at them like they could never do any wrong. My thought is simply this....burning bulldozers and spray painting signs get you nowhere and simply make Tennesseans like like dumb hicks. And to me that's exactly why I felt that the suggestion made in this article was counter productive and just plain stupid. I worked for a newspaper for 11 years so I do have a clue how these things work. Start a little fire and watch the fireflies gather. And yes Gman1 Vinson was successful in doing that but that is part of the problem. I truly think that education on a local level is the key here. Just because they build a mosque doesn't mean Murfreesboro will become a hotbed for al-quaeda and take over the Murfreesboro City Council which is probably what so many of these people are thinking. Robertson uses a mix of religion and politics to create fear in people and Tennesseans seem to buy into that hand and foot without even realizing how EXTREME that makes them in THEIR beliefs. Be a REAL Christian and ask a local Muslim what their really all about. Get educated! Get a clue!
Colonel...exactly! Gman1...the Olsteen comment was simply my attempt at TRYING to find someone a bit more neutral on a national level but if you read my entire posting you should know that I don't really encourage that kind of debate anyway. And yes most of them are in it for the money but that's the fault of the followers that through it at them like they could never do any wrong. My thought is simply this....burning bulldozers and spray painting signs get you nowhere and simply make Tennesseans like like dumb hicks. And to me that's exactly why I felt that the suggestion made in this article was counter productive and just plain stupid. I worked for a newspaper for 11 years so I do have a clue how these things work. Start a little fire and watch the fireflies gather. And yes Gman1 Vinson was successful in doing that but that is part of the problem. I truly think that education on a local level is the key here. Just because they build a mosque doesn't mean Murfreesboro will become a hotbed for al-quaeda and take over the Murfreesboro City Council which is probably what so many of these people are thinking. Robertson uses a mix of religion and politics to create fear in people and Tennesseans seem to buy into that hand and foot without even realizing how EXTREME that makes them in THEIR beliefs. Be a REAL Christian and ask a local Muslim what their really all about. Get educated! Get a clue!
By: hspeaks on 9/3/10
lexanne, you tell Gman1 to "be a REAL Christian and ask a local Muslim what their really all about"- DUH! That's exactly what Vinson was pointing out when he gave the 'idea' of a debate between Robertson and Cat Stevens, Something that will CLUE in America about what is really going on with this Islamic movement. Gman1 is right when he says that this article, to a point, "flushed" out the people afraid to say what they really feel because they are scared of losing their jobs. This in a issue that needs to be pinpointed and addressed at the highest level, not by local politicans worried about saying whatever they have to to get re-elected.
lexanne, you tell Gman1 to "be a REAL Christian and ask a local Muslim what their really all about"- DUH! That's exactly what Vinson was pointing out when he gave the 'idea' of a debate between Robertson and Cat Stevens, Something that will CLUE in America about what is really going on with this Islamic movement. Gman1 is right when he says that this article, to a point, "flushed" out the people afraid to say what they really feel because they are scared of losing their jobs. This in a issue that needs to be pinpointed and addressed at the highest level, not by local politicans worried about saying whatever they have to to get re-elected.
By: lexanne on 9/3/10
Hey no need to get nasty with the duh....I just don't think someone like Robertson should even be considered. That's all I'm saying. And believe me when I say I'm not excluding the local politician as part of the problem. True their fear of saying the wrong thing and not getting re-elected IS part of the problem as well but unfortunately that's a tough one thats unavoidable. But if Joe blow local citizen was more educated then the fear tactics that some of these politicians use mixing ultra conservative religious views with politics then those fear tactics such as those used by Robertson wouldn't have as great an impact and we would all be better Christians.
Hey no need to get nasty with the duh....I just don't think someone like Robertson should even be considered. That's all I'm saying. And believe me when I say I'm not excluding the local politician as part of the problem. True their fear of saying the wrong thing and not getting re-elected IS part of the problem as well but unfortunately that's a tough one thats unavoidable. But if Joe blow local citizen was more educated then the fear tactics that some of these politicians use mixing ultra conservative religious views with politics then those fear tactics such as those used by Robertson wouldn't have as great an impact and we would all be better Christians.
By: lexanne on 9/3/10
Hey no need to get nasty with the duh....I just don't think someone like Robertson should even be considered. That's all I'm saying. And believe me when I say I'm not excluding the local politician as part of the problem. True their fear of saying the wrong thing and not getting re-elected IS part of the problem as well but unfortunately that's a tough one thats unavoidable. But if Joe blow local citizen was more educated then the fear tactics that some of these politicians use mixing ultra conservative religious views with politics then those fear tactics such as those used by Robertson wouldn't have as great an impact and we would all be better Christians.
Hey no need to get nasty with the duh....I just don't think someone like Robertson should even be considered. That's all I'm saying. And believe me when I say I'm not excluding the local politician as part of the problem. True their fear of saying the wrong thing and not getting re-elected IS part of the problem as well but unfortunately that's a tough one thats unavoidable. But if Joe blow local citizen was more educated then the fear tactics that some of these politicians use mixing ultra conservative religious views with politics then those fear tactics such as those used by Robertson wouldn't have as great an impact and we would all be better Christians.
By: lexanne on 9/3/10
Hey no need to get nasty with the duh....I just don't think someone like Robertson should even be considered. That's all I'm saying. And believe me when I say I'm not excluding the local politician as part of the problem. True their fear of saying the wrong thing and not getting re-elected IS part of the problem as well but unfortunately that's a tough one thats unavoidable. But if Joe blow local citizen was more educated then the fear tactics that some of these politicians use mixing ultra conservative religious views with politics then those fear tactics such as those used by Robertson wouldn't have as great an impact and we would all be better Christians. In summary...just forget robertson.
Hey no need to get nasty with the duh....I just don't think someone like Robertson should even be considered. That's all I'm saying. And believe me when I say I'm not excluding the local politician as part of the problem. True their fear of saying the wrong thing and not getting re-elected IS part of the problem as well but unfortunately that's a tough one thats unavoidable. But if Joe blow local citizen was more educated then the fear tactics that some of these politicians use mixing ultra conservative religious views with politics then those fear tactics such as those used by Robertson wouldn't have as great an impact and we would all be better Christians. In summary...just forget robertson.
By: lexanne on 9/3/10
Hey no need to get nasty with the duh....I just don't think someone like Robertson should even be considered. That's all I'm saying. And believe me when I say I'm not excluding the local politician as part of the problem. True their fear of saying the wrong thing and not getting re-elected IS part of the problem as well but unfortunately that's a tough one thats unavoidable. But if Joe blow local citizen was more educated then the fear tactics that some of these politicians use mixing ultra conservative religious views with politics then those fear tactics such as those used by Robertson wouldn't have as great an impact and we would all be better Christians. In summary...just forget robertson.
Hey no need to get nasty with the duh....I just don't think someone like Robertson should even be considered. That's all I'm saying. And believe me when I say I'm not excluding the local politician as part of the problem. True their fear of saying the wrong thing and not getting re-elected IS part of the problem as well but unfortunately that's a tough one thats unavoidable. But if Joe blow local citizen was more educated then the fear tactics that some of these politicians use mixing ultra conservative religious views with politics then those fear tactics such as those used by Robertson wouldn't have as great an impact and we would all be better Christians. In summary...just forget robertson.
By: motcrewlo on 9/3/10
I see some merit in all the comments above. While Pat Robertson and Cat Stevens is a stretch, the mention of those names is what caused me to read the article. I dig Cat Stevens and then I saw the name Pat Robertson and knew I had to read the whole thing. If the writer had said Johnny Hunt debating Anwar al - Awlaki, it probably would be a better choice but I and probably others might have missed it. I know where you are coming from when you attack Pat Robertson. He has said some harsh things. But I not convinced that he wouldn;t be a worthy pick. He knows a lot about Christian religions. I don't think as much of Kobe Bryant since he was accused of raping that girl a few years back because I think he got out of it because he's a sports star with lots of money. But, I still would listen to K. Bryant if he became a NBA analyst after retiring.
I see some merit in all the comments above. While Pat Robertson and Cat Stevens is a stretch, the mention of those names is what caused me to read the article. I dig Cat Stevens and then I saw the name Pat Robertson and knew I had to read the whole thing. If the writer had said Johnny Hunt debating Anwar al - Awlaki, it probably would be a better choice but I and probably others might have missed it. I know where you are coming from when you attack Pat Robertson. He has said some harsh things. But I not convinced that he wouldn;t be a worthy pick. He knows a lot about Christian religions. I don't think as much of Kobe Bryant since he was accused of raping that girl a few years back because I think he got out of it because he's a sports star with lots of money. But, I still would listen to K. Bryant if he became a NBA analyst after retiring.
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